Joint tested and non tested comp
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| Carl |  | ... | 12-11-2007 @ 13:38 |
 Loves rugby league ... Member 13, 14460 posts SQ 230, BP 180.5, DL 262.5673.0 kgs @ 128kgs UnEq Administrator | i agre with what rob says, the only problems should arise when people use PED's in a drug free federation, it shouldnt matter who you train with or what you go to watch, aslong as you play by the rules | ||
| PorkPie | | ... | 12-11-2007 @ 13:58 |
 Do hugs, not drugs. Member 136, 712 posts SQ 380, BP 242.5, DL 330952.5 kgs @ 110kgs Eq | brynevans said: Porkpie seems to be fixated with this idea, if there is a demand for a non drug tested regional contest why is nobody doing it already? Perhaps he should have a go at it himself? Simply find a venue with the appropriate stands, weights, warmup area, get a group of spotters, 3 referees, scorer, MC then promote the event. It may work. Thanks for the advice. In a previous thread, you claimed this idea was unworkable Bryn. I've now shown you it isn't. It requires BWLA support to make it work, the reason BWLA would do this, is to recruit more members for themselves, not to help out BPC/BPO. | ||
| jimblanchflower | | ... | 12-11-2007 @ 14:42 |
Teabagger for hire Member 54, 237 posts | Whether or not you support this plan, I feel that the main stumbling block concerns certain BAWLA/IPF rules. As far as I am aware, BAWLA/IPF lifters can be banned for competing with, or otherwise aiding and abetting lifters from non-tested organisations. In the end it does not matter how illogical or unfair you consider the rules to be, you have to work with that which you cannot change. So how do the Welsh boys get away with it? Like any rule, it may not always be enforced. Like passing a policeman on the motorway at 85 mph; they may ignore you, but if they don't you could end up in the s**t. | ||
| Icepick | | ... | 12-11-2007 @ 14:49 |
 still a cock Member 55, 1213 posts SQ 50, BP 25, DL 55130.0 kgs @ 0.1kgs UnEq | PorkPie said: the reason BWLA would do this, is to recruit more members for themselves, not to help out BPC/BPO. The question that begs to be asked is why would a joint fed event recruit more lifters to bwla than more bwla only comps?? I personally cant see it tbh, its all sounds like fairy tale land to me. The situation in wales is unique in that there is a good commaderie between non and tested lifters there, but I would even go further to say that there are only a handful of lifters in this region, and the comps are done together to boost turnout numbers, and even then its not a lot! Getting back to the real world, it is very unlikely to see such joint venture spreading accross the country. Its not a stab at bpc/pbo whatever, I'm just bein realistic. | ||
| Joni | | ... | 12-11-2007 @ 15:06 |
 left the country satisfied Member 10, 19241 posts SQ 240, BP 150, DL 270660.0 kgs @ 107kgs UnEq | one of the positive things from this would be attracting new lifters due to there not being a steep membership fee, but just a comp entry fee. Hi Rep gym down south is doing something similar as well: http://z9.invisionfree.com/Strength_Discussion/index.php?showt... http://www.hirepgym.com/images/Strongman/hirep-bash-2007.gif | ||
| RobThomas | | ... | 12-11-2007 @ 17:20 |
Benches more than he deadlifts. Member 110, 91 posts SQ 340, BP 275, DL 270885.0 kgs @ 150kgs Eq | Post Edited: 12.11.2007 @ 17:27 PM What happens with the WSA comps is that there are 2 comps "invisibly" running side by side. There are basically 2 streams - an A stream and a B stream. If you lift with BWLA or the BDFPA then you lift in the A stream and the relevant testing people are informed about the competition ans we sign the same drug testing forms as we do at the BWLA British comps etc. "Other" lifters, whether they are BPC/BPO lifters or simply beginners then lift in the B stream with the two competitions running side by side. This means that the tested lifters are not actually competing against the non-tested lifters, they are simply lifting at the same time.The WSA is a very relaxed environment and is a fantastic "starting ground" for new lifters who don't know anything about feds, testing etc. to simply start lifting in a comp. Everyone will start off in the B stream unless they specifically want to join the WPU (that's the Welsh affiliation to BWLA). All the judging in the WSA is done to IPF regulations although it may be a little laxed on times - more so for the lifters in the B stream. A couple of the refs, including Mike Watts are official BWLA refs too. There aren't a great number of lifters in Wales from ANY of the feds, so the WSA is a way of being able to hold some sort of Welsh championships that EVERYONE can enter - albeit in 2 seperate "streams". Al from HiRep gym is very fond of the idea of the WSA and would love to emulate this at his place but unfortunately, I think he's having a few problems from certain places. Finally, there aren't any BWLA only comps run in Wales, if it wasn't for the WSA holding these comps and catering for WPU lifters (BWLA lifters) then there would be no way for welsh lifters to qualify for the British and so forth. It's a very well run "organisation" by very keen powerlifters, one of which is Phil Richard and I think we all know who that little midget is! | ||
| paul_richards | | ... | 12-11-2007 @ 18:04 |
 I personally prefer the stiffest possible. Member 158, 3110 posts SQ 170, BP 107.5, DL 222.5500.0 kgs @ 67.4kgs UnEq | The way forward I think for PL is to promote the drug free feds. I can't see how you can raise the profile and encourage non-lifters by supporting untested feds (just my view). I personally would like to see PL become an olympic sport 1 day and drug free is the only way forward for that. If you have/had say a 15yr kid interested in PL, would you want them at an untested comp, I know I wouldnt The Welsh idea seems to me to be a happy medium and is a solution for a unique situation. However I would be interested in whether it breaks any BWLA rules. | ||
| Carl | | ... | 12-11-2007 @ 18:38 |
Loves rugby league ... Member 13, 14460 posts SQ 230, BP 180.5, DL 262.5673.0 kgs @ 128kgs UnEq Administrator | i think your forgetting that its not a requirement to use ped's at a bpc/bpo comp, its simply untested | ||
| paul_richards | | ... | 13-11-2007 @ 00:00 |
I personally prefer the stiffest possible. Member 158, 3110 posts SQ 170, BP 107.5, DL 222.5500.0 kgs @ 67.4kgs UnEq | Carl said: i think your forgetting that its not a requirement to use ped's at a bpc/bpo comp, its simply untested If you didnt use drugs and competed in non-tested comps then you are surely disadvantaged. | ||
| Alex | | ... | 13-11-2007 @ 01:29 |
 Picca Boo Member 16, 1204 posts SQ 140, BP 130, DL 200470.0 kgs @ 77kgs UnEq | paul_richards said:I can't see how you can raise the profile and encourage non-lifters by supporting untested feds (just my view). I personally would like to see PL become an olympic sport 1 day and drug free is the only way forward for that. Yeah, cause the Olympics is full of clean athletes  If PL were to become an Olympic sport, the far bigger problem would be equipment, IMO. If you have/had say a 15yr kid interested in PL, would you want them at an untested comp, I know I wouldnt I would not condone drug use to my kids but would let them watch an untested comp for sure, plus the Tour de France. And rather untested PL than football anyday, lol. | ||
| Carl | | ... | 13-11-2007 @ 02:03 |
Loves rugby league ... Member 13, 14460 posts SQ 230, BP 180.5, DL 262.5673.0 kgs @ 128kgs UnEq Administrator | paul_richards said: Carl said: i think your forgetting that its not a requirement to use ped's at a bpc/bpo comp, its simply untested If you didnt use drugs and competed in non-tested comps then you are surely disadvantaged. yes but this doesnt mean that you shouldnt compete, most people seem to choose there federation based on what federation people in there gym lift in | ||
| RobThomas | | ... | 13-11-2007 @ 08:08 |
Benches more than he deadlifts. Member 110, 91 posts SQ 340, BP 275, DL 270885.0 kgs @ 150kgs Eq | Post Edited: 13.11.2007 @ 08:19 AM Well both the WSA and the WPU have been around for a few years now and WPU (BWLA) members can use the comp as a qualifier to the British and other BWLA members (English, Scottish and Northern Irish) can lift there and qualify for the Brits themselves - so long as they pay £5 to join the WSA.As I said, there are in effect TWO COMPS running side by side - one tested (and running under BWLA/IPF rules), the other one not so how can that break any BWLA/IPF rules? There are no non-tested lifters lifting in the A stream and all lifters in the A stream must be BWLA members (the BDFPA no longer lift here anymore). As for only encouraging drug tested lifting, that's fine if you only want to lift clean and lift within BWLA as most of us do but believe it or not, some people want to take gear and/or don't want to lift in BWLA. Some of these lifters enjoy lifting just as much as we do so isn't it only right that they have somewhere to lift too? I'd much rather see those lifters lift in the WSA's B stream and then possibly move on to the BPC or BPO instead of them "cheating" and trying to lift in BWLA. Also, some lifters simply want to lift in double ply equipment which isn't allowed in BWLA, others like to lift in comps full of the "razmataz" that comes with the BPC comps, surely it's all about choice and that's what the WSA does, it gives people the freedom/choice to lift wherever they like but then we can all have a bit of a get together a few times per year and have a really great day out. | ||
| Icepick | | ... | 13-11-2007 @ 10:22 |
still a cock Member 55, 1213 posts SQ 50, BP 25, DL 55130.0 kgs @ 0.1kgs UnEq | Nice post RT | ||
| Rick | | ... | 13-11-2007 @ 18:12 |
 I am a bench-only guy Member 3, 10035 posts SQ 185, BP 175, DL 235595.0 kgs @ 140kgs UnEq Administrator | Do, say, the B stream and A stream middleweights lift in the same flight, Rob? If so there'd be very little extra organisational overhead (*on the day*, see later) or time taken. I'd quite like to see this, not only for the sake of untested boys but more because people could lift on the day without having yet committed to BWLA membership. But, and it's a significant but, it *would* require a whole different set of eg insurance policies (as BWLA's cover wouldn't help the B stream), and doubtless other difficulties - which would be more trouble for Bryn or whomever to arrange than it's worth to us, since BWLA comps in the NW are very much viable as they are. Of course if an untested boy wanted to organise insurance etc for the B stream, it might put a different look on it (not in any way speaking for Bryn or Jim here, let me emphasise). Nice to see you posting over here, Rob - gonna start a log? | ||
| little_a | | ... | 20-11-2007 @ 09:05 |
 still a devious weightlifting bastard Member 43, 14374 posts | Just a thought lads. Once that BWLA is put right under the world spotlight in 2012, does anyone think that UKS will continue to fund BWLA to the extent they will up to that point. PL'rs probably do a lot better at world level than OL, but it is OL (as an Olympic sport) that attracts UKS funding to the degree it does, right or wrong, thats the case. When UKS realise (shock/ horror) that we aint a world leader in the weightlifting world how do you see that funding going? I believe that BWLA in it's current form has a very limited shelf life. It may continue, but it will need a radical overhaul following 2012 if it gets that far. Assuming UKS severe all ties with BWLA (which I can see) will the members be happy paying for the drug testing themselves? £300 a test boys. 10% of lifters tested in a comp say as an average. 30 lifters, £900 on top of running something like a regional comp? Would you guys mind paying the existing entry +£30 ea? My point is that you guys are all powerlifters and I believe inside the next 10 years you may all have a lot more in common than you currently suspect. The above is a personal projection of ideas and in no way based on conversations (which have never happened)with high ranking BWLA or UKS officials. Honest  | ||