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| » Is Competitive Powerlifting a Complete Farce? (Go to post) | 19-09-2007 @ 20:18 | ||
Originally posted by badboy007... I agree Jim, "I'm sure there's absolute freaks out there that do it though (and I think I know a few of these crazy f**ked up freaks of nature myself)." I don't want to get into debates about individual lifters, because we will never know. I do know more about powerlifting in the West Mids in particular than i'm letting on, and again I don't wanna get into this! If yhou found someone squatting 965+ lbs in single ply gear, great depth, drug free, then they would be the best squatter to ever walk the face of the earth. Period. Sorry to prolong this "debate" but this post has really bugged me so I've done a bit of research. The 965+ squat comment is clearly aimed at Clive Henry, who did 440 kilos (968 pounds) at the British Championships this year, setting a European squat record and a M1 World squat record. Clive has competed in the British Championships every year from 1991 to 2007 inclusive. He first lifted in 1991 at a bodyweight of 95.60; this year his bodyweight was 125.80. So when you take account of his improvements, you need to bear in mind he has gained 30 kilos of quality muscle slowly and gradually over 16 years. In order, his Wilks points score over the years has been (in round figures): 478/469/499/513/529/546/530/528/538/554/567/587/577/579/578. I've used Wilks rather than totals because it's easier to relate to the improvements without having to correlate totals to variable bodyweights. Clive has competed for 16 years continuously and has improved his Wilks total by exactly 100 points over 16 years. That's an average of just over 6 points a year and that improvement will be partly due to the vast improvements in supportive equipment since 1991. Factor in the equipment and the improvement would probably be nearer 3 or 4 points a year. You get really good at powerlifting and last for a long time by steadily improving year after year after year. Clive has been subject to countless tests over this period and has passed every one. No one in BWLA is "protecting" him or anyone else. Those allegations are just ill informed internet bulls**t. The reason I have bothered replying at all is that some of the younger members might be swayed by the "everybody's on it" bulls**tters and if even one is persuaded to go down that route then it's one too many. As Jim says, you don't need drugs. And Clive doesn't deserve that type of slur. I don't give a runny s**te what people think privately, but suggesting everyone is doing it on a forum like this might lead people astray. By the way, Dean Bowring's Wilks improvement is 99 points between 1995 and 2007, an average of just over 8 a year and quite a bit of that will be bench shirt related. Same progression as Clive - lots of hard work, technical improvements, improved muscle, tendon and ligament strength. And test after test after test over the period, clean every time. So don't you lads starting out fall for this drugs bulls**t. Committment, hard work, good coaching and longevity will get you there - in about 15 years! | |||
| » Is Competitive Powerlifting a Complete Farce? (Go to post) | 19-09-2007 @ 14:40 | ||
Originally posted by little_a... Originally posted by Martin1956... Very briefly, the Olympic motto translates as Faster, Higher, Stronger. But is that actually the Olympic motto? Both the 5 rings and the Olympic flame were 'invented' by the Nazi's for the 36 games. In short they have no history in the Olympics and although they make great spectacle they were nonetheless put there by one of the most hateful organisations ever. It may seem off thread, but brings home to me that not all the truths that we base our life decisions on are in fact truths. Also, with the above in mind, are you guys really so kean to be part of such a movement? Sorry - you're completely wrong. The Olympic Motto is "Citius, Altius, Fortius", which translates as "Faster/Swifter, Higher, Stronger". If the purpose of the Olympics in part is to allow the world's strongest people to compete, then why does the world's strongest sport not get in when synchronised swimming and synchronised diving do? This had nothing to do with the Nazis - it was proposed by Baron Pierre De Coubertin, the founder of the modern Olympics, in 1896. The Olympic Flag was with the five rings was adopted in 1914, but because of WW1 was used for the first time at the Antwerp Games in 1920. Again nothing to do with the Nazis. The Olympic Flame tradition started in 1928, well before the Berlin Games. The flame relay was first staged in Berlin and has continued ever since. To try and associate a festival to bring the youth of the world together in sporting friendship with the Nazis is totally wrong. | |||
| » Is Competitive Powerlifting a Complete Farce? (Go to post) | 19-09-2007 @ 11:05 | ||
| Badboy, I didn't aim my reply at you. It was more a general comment and a reflection on previous discussions elsewhere. Life is a series of self fulfilling prophesies and if powerlifters themselves, or at least ones in a position of influence, believe powerlifting will never become an Olympic sport, then it won't - simple as. Very briefly, the Olympic motto translates as Faster, Higher, Stronger. Powerlifting is the ultimate strength sport. If we can have synchronised swimming, handball and the like, why not the ultimate strength sport? As for no powerlifting if there's weightlifting, we have two entirely different forms of canoeing, and synchronised swimming takes place alongside swimming and diving, so that's no argument. Not saying it will ever happen, just that we shouldn't stop trying. And everytime a powerlifter knocks powerlifting, they reduce the chance of it happening. | |||
| » Is Competitive Powerlifting a Complete Farce? (Go to post) | 19-09-2007 @ 09:50 | ||
| I tend to get into quite heated debates on other sites about "supplementing" in powerlifting. Undoubtedly it goes on, and I can't be sure about the extent it does, but my bugbear is the "virtually all top lifters juice" brigade who just present their assumptions as facts courtesy of secret information and "someone I know" who lifts at national standard. There are lots of tricks to avoid positive tests, the authorities are in connivance with the athletes, lots of things are undetectable, etc., etc. Inevitably, not everyone is clean. Some of the lifters I was in Germany with last week will have been on gear or growth, but I don't think any of the British lads were. And I'd bet a year's mortgage that people like Marie are clean as a whistle, but guys who can't accept being outsquatted by "a mere girl" have to find a reason to salve their own self esteem. There's about a 10% chance a lifter will be selected for testing at the event, and not all feds are as assiduous as we are in the UK on out of competition testing. There IS scope for people at my level to take drugs. As a Master who is nowhere near the elite senior squad, UK Sport are not going to waste £300 on testing me, so if I want to juice up and come off before competitions I could. I choose not to, I can look myself in the mirror aand know I'm clean, but can I prove it? No, unless I get tested twice a week, every week, the naysayers can suggest that I'm just being clever. I can only talk about Britain, but all our elite athletes get tested before being selected for squads, they get tested at squads, and they get random tested as well. These guys in the main will be naturally strong guys who have trained hard for years before reaching elite level and who then continue to progress through the squad system and the additional stimulus of international competition. That's why they can lift what they do. People who juice ruin the sport and reduce the chance of powerlifting developing, farless getting into the Olympics. Why should anyone have qualms about "grassing up" someone who is dragging down the sport that they love? I'll leave it there. | |||
| » NW lifters at South Yorks (Go to post) | 18-09-2007 @ 09:05 | ||
Post Edited: 18.09.2007 @ 09:08 AM I think the "new guy" was Chris Baker. He's been lifting in BDFPA recently and lifts raw only. Really, really strong bencher.Greater lifting by Marie. If Mick gets his bench anywhere near the standard of his other two lifts he'd be 1000+ evey time. And how good a deadlifter is Ian? He'd be respectably in the supers with a 300+ pull. Well done. | |||
| » WOODY ALLEN SYNDROME (Go to post) | 18-09-2007 @ 09:02 | ||
| Thanks Tom. Spot on. Why can't I be that concise?! | |||
| » Titan Singlets (Go to post) | 18-09-2007 @ 00:44 | ||
Welcome on board, Andy! I'd second your American wrestling suggestion, but if anyone else gets a gold one it'll just push me towards face paint to preserve my golden advantage. What do the rules say about face paint with regard to identification, btw? Maybe I could recruit the new clean Boar as a tag team partner and hit 200 that way. | |||
| » WOODY ALLEN SYNDROME (Go to post) | 18-09-2007 @ 00:26 | ||
Originally posted by sivvy1... excellent to hear martin whats the plan with training now? what do you normally do after a competition? Normally, I'd ease back a bit, Sivvy, but I've got the WDFPF Worlds in four weeks and the NW Bench the week after and the 200 challenge!!! Wait until Thursday to let the travel and the shots out of my system before I bench again, but I'll go in Wednesday to do some cardio and light back and shoulders and sweat out the toxins. I'm going to adjust my training based on the advice I got from people who know far better than me. I'll post a routine when I've sorted out how to adapt properly. The things to consider include: Shirts - Joachim reckons the katana HAS to hit bang on the nipple line or it doesn't work, whereas the fury/f6 are more forgiving with a wider sweet spot. But Joachim gets 10K more from the katana and at top level that's a huge advantage to give away. Ian and Julian reckon I should try an arched shirt because I get a reasonable arch when I lock my back in. I need to train in a shirt at least once a week to practice the line, get used to lifting in it and get used to shedloads of weight at the end of the arms. Mike Frankeneli uses three shirts in a competition, each one progressively tighter. Others wear loose shirts they can put on unassisted and lock them in when they adopt the lifting position. I train raw and stick a shirt on in comps, but I've got to learn the shirt far more. Problem is keeping in the heavy raw work and the speed work when I know from experience I can't recover in time from three full on sessions a week. Does something have to give, or can I say combine shirted work with speed work? I'm going to try out an F6 before Rome. Anyone got a 46 or even a 48 I can have a play with? Bands - I bought three sets of bands off Larry Miller. I had a long talk with him about improving carry over, and basically bands are a must for most of the top lifters. Great if I could train bench 4 times a week, but I would never recover in time to have a good next one. Raw/Equipped - I love competing raw, but all the big comps are equipped. Do I focus on using the bench shirt well and maybe letting my raw numbers suffer? Or do I keep my raw strength up and try to combine that with better technique? Raw means diddly squat when you go and play with the big boys. Chris can probably outbench Ian by 25 kilos raw, but Ian hit the 217 and Chris didn't. I took a fiver off Julian at the Raw Bench, but he had a go at 202 on his third lift while I just scraped a 180... Totally separately, Big Jim would have medalled if he'd been able to go. The big German opened at 317 and bombed; Dan Goudreau did 285 then jumped to 320 and missed it twice but his 285 won gold. Jim would have taken him on bodyweight, and you don't read that every day!!! Second in the supers was 255, third 235. So Chris was in good company. Pooh Bear (one of the big Americans) bombed as well and Big Bill Gillespie opened at 332 last year in Miami and bombed, so if you're reading this, Chris, you're in exalted company. Big Steve Demeis didn't get a raw British record because it was not done in a specifically unequipped event, so I'm trying to persuade him to do the NW Bench as a guest, and Chris is planning an attempt on his own raw British record then as well. Should be a great day. Three and a half hours sleep after 40 shots and a long day travelling and I'm still wide awake and buzzing at half past midnight. Isn't adrenaline wonderful?! | |||
| » WOODY ALLEN SYNDROME (Go to post) | 17-09-2007 @ 22:46 | ||
| I'm back and I've had the most fabulous few days... but let's get the bad stuff out of the way first. The journey there was terrible. Got to Berlin ok and was to be met there by someone holding a "bench press" placard - but I wasn't. Waited three hours until I could contact the team manager (who happened to be at a funeral with his phone off) before going to the station and getting a train. It was one of these "if I go now it'll come along in five minutes..." scenarios. Hotel we were at was a 10 euro taxi ride away and the bus to the venue was very unreliable. And that's the bad stuff. I've just been privileged to spend the last few days in the company of some of the strongest men and women on the planet. These guys are not just awesomely strong. They're approachable, often very humble, and have no problem with guys like me lifting 40 kilos or more below the winning standard. And the banquet on the last evening is a chance to rub shoulders with them informally, and to strike friendships with like minded people from all over the world that often last a lifetime. If you saw the way so many of the lifters greeted each other as long lost friends and the genuine warmth of the greeetings, you would understand. Many of them are fierce competitors and rivals, but our main battle is against ourselves and the true measure of one's performance is either pbing as a Master or defying the aging process and going on year after year. Without being negative, I don't honestly think I'll ever medal in the IPFs - the standard is just too far above what I'm doing now and is rising every year. And what the over 60s are doing now is just plain scary. And my friend Bill McFadden did 172.5 aged 73 in the 90s. But I'll keep going every year for as long as I possibly can, just because it's such a wonderful thing to be part of. Germany was great. I'd never been there before. Schedwt/Oder is in NE Germany, only about a mile from the Polish border. More about Poland later. Everything is clean, everyone is polite and courteous. I'd like to tell you about three random acts of kindness - two now, one later. At the airport, a guy there to collect a friend heard my phone call to the team manager. He told me where to get a train to Schwedt/Odrer (I'll call it SO from now on), and gave me a lift to the station to save me a taxi fare. I met Derek Pender from Geordieland and his family on the platform when we changed trains at Angermunde. When we got into SO there were no taxis and we had no idea how to get one or to find our hotels, so Derek went into the police station to see if they could help call a cab. When they found out we were competing in the "Bankdrucken", they called us in, rustled up a police van, and took us to our hotels. I don't care what they say about the Germans getting their towels on the sun loungers, I found virtually everyone I met absolutely delightful. The Brits... We had a good championships on the whole. Only one bomb and that was Chris Edwards (Rhino) who was absolutely distraught to bomb at his first worlds, so let's deal with that first. His bomb was partly my fault. I was in charge of getting his shirt on, but none of us had any experience with Metals and we clearly didn't do as good a job as the lads in his own gym. he warmed up to 185 raw, ffs. That's how strong he was, and he does 225+ in the gym, so tjhought 217.5 was a safe opener. Only on the day, sadly it wasn't. We can't explain why these things happen, but we've all had days like that. Big respect to Chris for showing up at the banquet although he was clearly devastated. With this experience behind him, he'll come back better and stronger next April. I didn't have my best day at the office either. I opened with 180 and got absolutely nowhere with the first attempt. My shirt wasn't on right either. I got it adjusted a bit for my second attempt but it still wasn't right, but luckily I managed to force it up somehow. I wasn't in 192 form, but there was nothing to be gained place-wise from a more conservative third (seven guys went over 200 and I "won" the Sub-200s battle!)so I try a British record and failed to get it even half way. Pity, because I could have locked it if I had. I've learned a lot from listening to the Americans and the Germans, especially my namesake Joachim Flett whose 247.5 gave him 2nd place in the M1 100s - and he's M2 next year, ffs - and I'll do a separate write up on that when I plough my way through this. The British boys gelled really well as a group and it was good to both renew old friendships and make new ones. Steve Demeis's 187.5 doesn't look too great on the results sheet, but he was one of only two guys (our Gavin Waker was the other one) who did all three lifts raw and he was the only person the loaders applauded off the platform after EVERY lift throughout the competition. That tells you all you need to know. First timer Cliff Haynes got a silver with 150 in the 67s and Alex Lee added a bronze in the 82s (he had to move up)to the silver he got in the 175s next year. Bill McFadden and Norman Anderson came first and third in the M4 overall prize (judged on Wilks)and Bill got 2 world records in MY katana (reflected glory) at 165 and 172.5. Ian Kinghorn did a great job sorting everyone out, Julian was... well, Julian and the whole thing just wouldn't be the same without him, Handsome Fred lifted well after injury and all the new boys did well. I made lots of new friends at the banquet. Wearing the kilt was the calatyst, I guess. The following days I went to Poland with Deb and Michelle from the American team, driven there by the owner of one of the local restaurants. Lovely scenery, but the poverty is frightening. When we got back, there were some other Americans waiting and we all sat down to eat. The owner, Hagen, was a genial giant, weighing in at 145 kilos. "You are my honoured guests, tonight EVERYTHING is on the house"! After an hour of eating so much that none of us could move, the drinks came out. We started about 9 and finished at 3 in the morning. I reckon I had AT LEAST 40 shots, but I managed to walk away. We agreed that what happens in Germany stays in Germany, but I will say that not everyone walked away. Some were carried. How I survived, I don't know. It was my first spirits since New Year. But I didn't challenge Hagen to an under the table drinking contest, so I had a few less than the two fools who did. they were the ones carried out. More I will not say!!! I'm delighted and honoured to have struck up a friendship with Deb Ferrell, easily the best tested women bench presser of all time. Deb did 190 in Miami last year, and this year she did 175 after major operation on her rotator cuff to win the Best Lifter award in Women's M1. We've got a friendly rivalry about who will do 200 first, but when you read this Deb I sort of hope it's you, because you're in a different league to me, girl! Stay strong, see you next April. Well that's a long post. I'll post some more tomorrow if I've left everthing out, once the shots have left my system. A fabulous few days - I'm still buzzing. Experiences like that make the week in week out gym grind SOOOO worth it. | |||
| » WOODY ALLEN SYNDROME (Go to post) | 11-09-2007 @ 13:03 | ||
| Thanks for all the good wishes - on here, texts and emails! Flying out early tomorrow morning so will not be posting again until Monday night - assuming the dogs don't eat my computer while I'm away! The doubts are kicking in already. At least that gets rid of the complacency. Gold it is, btw! | |||
| » Are you in your comfort zone? (Go to post) | 10-09-2007 @ 11:57 | ||
| My training is geared to competitions. I'm not worried any more about my gym lifts. I go balls to the wall once a week on ME bench day. Don't need to on DE day on the bench, but do really hammer assistance on DE day. Other days are just about keeping the upper body in balance, so sometimes I hammer them and other times I have a gentle one. Depends how up for it I am on the day. I don't waste feelgood days and don't flog a dead horse on flat days. I used to work myself into a frazzle every workout, but now it's more about train smarter, not harder. Admittedly I'm only training for bench though. I don't even try 1RM pbs in the gym any more. I save them for comps. If I can improve my reps pbs in the gym, I'm happy that these will translate into 1RM pbs on the stage. So yes I'm probably in a comfort zone - comfortable that what I'm doing's working and I'm still progressing at an age when I should be going backwards. | |||
| » Members going off thread (Go to post) | 09-09-2007 @ 21:18 | ||
| My penis was perfectly proportioned to the rest of my body until my bodyweight increased by 50%... | |||
| » WOODY ALLEN SYNDROME (Go to post) | 09-09-2007 @ 20:54 | ||
| Cheers guys! A month's worth of responses in a couple of hours!!! Gold it is then, if the built in garters pass the IPF kit check. Thanks for the good wishes. Nico, ask away - but I might not be as clued up as you seem to imagine, and the little I know is mostly courtesy of internet forums. | |||
| » WOODY ALLEN SYNDROME (Go to post) | 09-09-2007 @ 19:52 | ||
Post Edited: 03.04.2010 @ 16:23 PM by Martin1956 I've been keeping a training log over on PLUK (Back Training At Last!!!) where I've charted my progress from my first tentative bench session after injury, through my WDFPF M3 record, to my peaking for the IPF World Masters Bench.The injury is just about gone (I'll probably always have a niggly shoulder, but it's not hampering my lifting any more) and I thought it was about time I started a new journal with new goals. The feedback on my PLUK log has almost dried up, and those that do post are mostly Sugden members as well, so I thought it was about time I moved over here. Plus this forum seems generally more active and supportive than any of the others. It probably helps that lots of us know each other through NW and British events. So, this being my first post, I'll recap on what I did today. Bar for 10 40 for 10 60 for 8 80 for 6 100 for 4 120 for 2 140 for 1 Shirt on and 180 (no touch) for 1. 35 minutes cardio, 6 sets of hammer curls, and that's it weights-wise, altjhough I'll do cardio tomorrow and Tuesday to keep my fitness up and my weight down. I was really pleased with the 180. The no touch was because the shirt rode up on me and was across my throat (didn't have my lever belt with me). It flew up like there were wooden weights on the bar. I've never had 180 fly up like that. And if it had gone right down, there'd probably have been more rebound and even more speed. I would love to come home with a 192.5 under my belt (BWLA British M2 record has stood at 190 since 1999) and I'm really buzzing after that 180, in spite of not touching. A good belt and some adrenaline will get a touch on Friday, no problem, and I'm hoping Chris Edwards (Rhino) will be around to help me into the shirt on the day. NO ONE gets you into a shirt like Chris! The lockout work I've been doing for the last three weeks seems to have taken me forward. I'd welcome some advice before I fly off on Wednesday morning... My Adidas gold trainers (with three red stripes to match my Katana, of course) arrived yesterday. Now, should I be patriotic and wear red, white and blue since I'm lifting for Britain, or should I go gold leotard and gold trainers? And if the latter, should I wear red socks, or gold socks (assuming I can find some by Tuesday afternoon)? Or maybe one red and one gold? This sartorial dilema is causing sleepless nights! Advice is urgently required! | |||
| » Haydens log (Go to post) | 08-09-2007 @ 17:06 | ||
| Last two posts sound like a preview of Prison Break 3. | |||