Greatness

Didnt realise until last night that Van Gogh, one of the most celebrated artists of all time, never actually knew that he was any good and in fact his works were only really appreciated after his death.
Question - whatever you wanted to be good at would it be enough for you to know that you would be recognised post mortem or would you need to have that recognition whilst alive and be able to bask in the glory of ones accomplishments? Purely hypothetical obviously as we're all s**t anyway.

Didnt you see dr who the other week mate, He had a trip in the tardis to find out how good he was?

I did see it, but not last week. Last night in fact, using my time machine AKA Virgin+

Perhaps he believed in reincarnation and had the opportunity to see his life's work gaining it's full appreciation? He could be reading this thread now! In years gone by designers of huge cathedrals would never actually see the finished product as they died before completion as they took so long and life expectancy was shorter.
I can see art of a certain style being in or out of fashion and that if a particular artist from the past suddenly seemed to to be in vogue 20-30 years later there's a fair chance they'd be no longer alive.

Good point, and I guess further along that road you have things like the pyramids etc, but the designers and builders of these things believed that they would be finished, they would be appreciated and the artisans involved would have respect. That was the buy in they accepted. Vincent turned out all this work to be told at the time that it was pretty crap yet is amongst the most expensive of our time. Still, if you really did believe you were great but were the only one that maybe enough to tip you over the edge. Hmmmm

'Fame' and 'celebrity' I would actively avoid (not that there is any possibility of these in my fields of endeavour). Quiet recognition (professional equivalent to the paternal pat on the back) is no bad thing, although I've always found overt praise rather embarrassing. I like the idea that somebody, years after my death, might read some of my work and find it useful - a position in which I have often found myself when reading both secondary and primary literature. As it is, whenever I finish something, I dismiss it as a poor effort and immediately move glumly to the next project in the hope that I might make a better job of it.

I believe that Van Gogh believed his work was wank because it was, and still is, wank. Take this for example:
http://www.photoshopsupport.com/tutorials/or/van-gogh-effect/v...
..even the vase is out of proportion. Nowadays people claim that all thee imperfections weere intentional but I call bulls**t. There are plenty of incredible works by the masters that s**t all over this impressionism s**t. Impressionism is just an excuse for having s**t brush skills.

Anyway, my vote for the greatest person whoever lived goes to Da Vinci. Now HE was talented.

Many writers were in the same situation.

I've never been to the Van Gogh Museum, it's always slipped my mind for some reasons!

lmao....

Arnie is the greatest person to ever live IMO

If you dont agree, "sue me....dickhead!"

i when the the Van Gogh museum last year and it was ok i didnt have a clue what i was looking at but found out how much of a fruit loop the guy was. this was why he proberly thought his art was crap. he never made a massive living from it and he had more loose screws than an ikea sideboard

We should try and go in Sept?

I would like to be thought absolutely brilliant whilst I am alive, and then for people to realise that I was actually s**t after I have been killed by a cynical middle aged academic - Like Cheryl Cole next week.

Ita factum sit! But I also think that Ms Cole exemplifies the negative aspects of 'fame': would any amount of pecuniary reward compensate the lack of privacy and the endless scrutiny by an ill-informed public?

I tend to agree with Odious Slob, I think a lot of art is over rated and can be bettered by the average 10 year old. Same with literature, the "academics" read into things, over analyse and convince each other that things were intentionally put there when they were not.

Personally, I can live without fame and celebrity, I'm happy with a wad of cash and my fair share of pussy.