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ben66Icon...26-11-2015 @ 14:05 
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Why get fat to look big?
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AMH_Power said:
Hi mate. I won the WDFPF champs at the start of this month. 800 is a fair bit off yet; my squat was motoring until I tore my meniscus (not a lifting injury).
I did a 262.5kg pretty comfortable at comp, and will continue to improve on it. Will do 275 prior march, 290+ by august. My comp total was still a pb, and will beat the wdfpf world/brit record in March, which will be my last bdfpa event before gbpf.
The total is 762.5 which will be no problem.


You've got great contributions to Sugden Aaron, very educational and informative every time Happy
HUGE_GUYIcon...26-11-2015 @ 14:45 
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Post Edited: 26.11.2015 @ 14:45 PM by HUGE_GUY
Response to AMH

I want to try this. A couple of questions though.

So the AMAP day is the same as Mondays set/rep range but just easier?
When it is 3x8 (x2) Why is this different from 6 sets of 8? and did i read that right, multi sets of 8?!
AMH_PowerIcon...26-11-2015 @ 17:26 
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HUGE_GUY said:Response to AMH

I want to try this. A couple of questions though.

So the AMAP day is the same as Mondays set/rep range but just easier?
When it is 3x8 (x2) Why is this different from 6 sets of 8? and did i read that right, multi sets of 8?!


Correct, monday to friday is always progressively easier; but efforts will feel similar. It's to offset fatigue.

The 3x8 is GPE, so fluff type stuff. The (x2) is two different exercises.

for clarification;

It's two weeks, alternating:

m S+B
w Dead
f S+B
m Dead
w S+B
F Dead

With accessory of the opposites done concurrently (so deadlift fluff on squat and bench day, and vice versa).

The actual accessory and main lift type change subject to phase, with very specific work in the power/speed phase, and more generic work furthest from comp.

A good rule of thumb is to supplement on all planes/axis. So, naturally, we press forward on bench... it makes sense to use an overhead and a dip/tricep extension for accessory.

Likewise, we pull upward on deadlift, so makes sense to pull downward (pullup), and pull horizontal (bent over row)...or similar. This leaves core to be worked for squat accessory... for a pretty complete system.

anyway.. I digress. Hope that sheds some light
AaronJIcon...26-11-2015 @ 19:12 
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Thanks for that Aaron.

Great info.
AMH_PowerIcon...26-11-2015 @ 19:44 
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AaronJ said:Thanks for that Aaron.

Great info.


Anytime
RobboIcon...26-11-2015 @ 20:56 
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Fantastic read, thanks AMH

I have often found that after running a volume/intensity routine that my strength always peaks a week or 2 after the day I'm supposed to hit a new max. After reading that, it makes sense why.

I think psychologically, it's hard for a lifter to let go of the heavy weights 4 weeks out and start tapering down. I would struggle to do that anyway, but it all makes more sense as to why now.
HUGE_GUYIcon...26-11-2015 @ 21:45 
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4 weeks without heavy weights. For the natural lifter, what does this do for the test/gh levels? There must be some kind of decline?

What happens when the cycle ends.
AMH_PowerIcon...26-11-2015 @ 22:18 
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HUGE_GUY said:4 weeks without heavy weights. For the natural lifter, what does this do for the test/gh levels? There must be some kind of decline?

What happens when the cycle ends.


Don't forget hypertrophy is related to work, and hormone response related to tensile strength... as part of a response to the golgi feedback loop OR muscle spindle.

The spindle element is trained naturally as part of the power and speed phase anyway; it's the protective element that detects the rate of change in a muscle and contracts antagonist to prevent damage (like, punching out to the front your bicep counters the tricep to stop you over extending your elbow).

As for the golgi aspect; we can trick it (don't forget that resultant forces generated from the momentum of the power phase will trigger it anyway). Fatigue is massively correlated to work. Work is force applied over a distance (and power is the display of how quick this can happen)....

Well, we can do static holds with SUPRAmaximal loads in the power phase. This will continue to activate our natural limiter; the GTO and will cause the anabolic hormone spikes we need... without interfering with the staging or causing excess fatigue (work is 0).

Also, contrary to popular belief.... hormone profiles become unfavourable after around 3 weeks of VERY hard work, and hormone profiles drastically IMPROVE following 3 weeks of NOTHING. Obviously, we need the balance... and that balance is power and speed.

Lars Andersen et al. in 2005 summary of ZERO training in advanced athletes:
-the muscular strength fibers appear not to change for up to one month.
-their hormonal profile became more favorable. The growth hormone and testosterone levels increased, while levels of cortisol, the “stress hormone,” decreased.

This type of lifting is actually more suitable to drug free lifters; the rate of adaptation is slower than those on peptides and anabolic substances. PED users may benefit a lot more from the hypertrophy side, and a continued change in stimulus... a conjugated system or dare I say WSBB.

Another point to note, testosterone manipulation for drug free lifters is NOT the key (say whaaaaa?). Insulin manipulation for a drug free lifter will dwarf the effects of doing all the standard test boosting s**t like DAA, ZMA, Resveratol... 8 hours sleep, masturbate 2x a day, watch UFC, don't eat or drink from BPA containing plastics bla bla.

Insulin. The problem is; it doesn't discriminate between muscle and adipose tissue. However; after heavy weight lifting glucose transporters (SLC2A's or TGLUT) come to the surface of the fibril to draw in blood sugar to the muscle to replenish glycogen reserves. The beauty is, if we eat some s**tty foods after lifting, these transporters clear blood sugars into the muscle (turbo pump anyone?), THEN insulin spikes as a response from the high blood sugars. Insulin doesn't discriminate; muscle grows from the insulin... fat tries to grow but there is no glucose to inject in the adipose! (it was stolen by the SLC2A's)... WIN.
Protein f**ks this process up due to its low glycemic index, and is a myth from the 70's that we should eat protein straight after.... or what!? I won't repair??? I'll remember that if I break a leg... "quick, get me a f**king protein bar or this s**t won't fix".

However, glucose transporters do reside back in to the muscle, and will break lean tissue down to replenish energy reserves and make us all look like Paula Ratcliffe.

Protein IS important, but the optimal window is a feint line between however short it is and however long it is; almost irrelevant. The optimal window to capitalize on Insulin is immediately after lifting.

A double combo would be to have amino's prior lifting; this can prevent cell breakdown for repair if ready available proteins are indeed low (your body uses standard catabolic processes anyway...it breaks itself down to repair the damage done, protein intake replens the global deficit... not your calf/bicep or whatever).

I'm sure someone in the know can provide more information on the biology side, I just like lifting! (and writing long posts too pmsl).
AMH_PowerIcon...26-11-2015 @ 22:18 
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Robbo said:Fantastic read, thanks AMH

I have often found that after running a volume/intensity routine that my strength always peaks a week or 2 after the day I'm supposed to hit a new max. After reading that, it makes sense why.

I think psychologically, it's hard for a lifter to let go of the heavy weights 4 weeks out and start tapering down. I would struggle to do that anyway, but it all makes more sense as to why now.


Thanks for reading!
aaron_lohanIcon...27-11-2015 @ 09:18 
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Robbo said:Fantastic read, thanks AMH

I think psychologically, it's hard for a lifter to let go of the heavy weights 4 weeks out and start tapering down. I would struggle to do that anyway, but it all makes more sense as to why now.


Very true and I used to find that, then before the 2014 world bench i was scheduled to do my last heavy bench 10 days before the comp but there werent enough people in the gym to spot me so I did a light raw session, at that comp I hit a comp and all time pb. Now i tend to have my last heavy session 18-21 days beforehand. I might have to experiment with longer.
AMH_PowerIcon...27-11-2015 @ 09:21 
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aaron_lohan said:
Very true and I used to find that, then before the 2014 world bench i was scheduled to do my last heavy bench 10 days before the comp but there werent enough people in the gym to spot me so I did a light raw session, at that comp I hit a comp and all time pb. Now i tend to have my last heavy session 18-21 days beforehand. I might have to experiment with longer.


Its good to hear I'm not alone and that the science shows true.
It does take some confidence though to stay away from heavy work near meets!
BimIcon...27-11-2015 @ 10:13 
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No heavy lifting from 4 weeks out sounds ridiculous, I don't know that I could manage it without losing all confidence in what I could lift.

aaron_lohan said:
Very true and I used to find that, then before the 2014 world bench i was scheduled to do my last heavy bench 10 days before the comp but there werent enough people in the gym to spot me so I did a light raw session, at that comp I hit a comp and all time pb. Now i tend to have my last heavy session 18-21 days beforehand. I might have to experiment with longer.


That would drive me crazy! What training do you do for the last three weeks?
HUGE_GUYIcon...27-11-2015 @ 10:21 
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Thanks for the informative post AMH, this is the kind of stuff i come on forums for.

Having looked at my old journals in my athletics days, it does seem to be similar to this set up without me realising it. Heavy 5s and 3s for ages, fast doubles at 80% for a few weeks, a week taper, then i PB in a comp. Then weights PBs in the gym the following week. Then i'm fu**ed for a few weeks because i get greedy maxing everything.

Do you take time off after the competition? Or straight into the over 85% work again?
AMH_PowerIcon...27-11-2015 @ 11:17 
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HUGE_GUY said:Thanks for the informative post AMH, this is the kind of stuff i come on forums for.

Having looked at my old journals in my athletics days, it does seem to be similar to this set up without me realising it. Heavy 5s and 3s for ages, fast doubles at 80% for a few weeks, a week taper, then i PB in a comp. Then weights PBs in the gym the following week. Then i'm fu**ed for a few weeks because i get greedy maxing everything.

Do you take time off after the competition? Or straight into the over 85% work again?


I would use the meet as the start of the next cycle; given that its all about heavy work in the accumulation!
I'd probably still take a few days to rif myself of comp stress
aaron_lohanIcon...27-11-2015 @ 11:51 
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Bim said:No heavy lifting from 4 weeks out sounds ridiculous, I don't know that I could manage it without losing all confidence in what I could lift.
That would drive me crazy! What training do you do for the last three weeks?


Light raw stuff mainly with low volume, the last session would be on the wednesday or the previous friday if i was lifting on wed or thursday. I used to feel that way but gradually it changed. In my first few years i was still working up to openers 5-6 days before, then I would go up to my opener 10 days before, now I do my last heavy session around 3 weeks out. People think they will lose strength by lifting less than 90% but it is not true, the percentages required to keep and gain strength are much lower than what people think.

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