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Tokars 5x3 System

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Comments thread for: Tokars 5x3 System

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BazIcon...16-05-2007 @ 20:41 
Weak training is still training.
Member 63, 260 posts
SQ 135, BP 110, DL 195
440.0 kgs @ 78kgs UnEq
Just to reinforce the good advice already given, if you run before you lift you will be depleting your muscle's stores of glycogen, meaning when you lift you will find you dont have as much immediate energy. Even worse if you use up enough glycogen your body will look to alternative sources for energy and can start to catabolise the very muscle your working hard to gain! Eek
littlegirlbunnyIcon...29-05-2007 @ 09:13 
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MIA
Member 7, 621 posts
SQ 80, BP 45, DL 125
250.0 kgs @ 55kgs UnEq
Ok, so I have been trying to work out the best cycle from this program. But it is actually quite hard when your rep strenght (I have repped 42.5 kg for 5's and doubled the current PB for 5 sets) is so much better than the 1RM. But I intially decided on this:

Session 1: 37.5 kg: 5x3
Session 2: 40 kg: 3x2
Session 3: 42.5 kg: 2x1
Session 4: 40 kg: 5x3
Session 5: 42.5 kg: 3x2
Session 6: 45 kg: 2x1

The problem is, I guess, that I have already done 5 doubles with 45 kg, so to just end the cycle on 2 singles seems really low. But then, benching is going a bit crap at the moment, so it may be about right.

Alternatively, I could bring out the microplates and start a kilo higher on each lift:
Session 1: 38.5 kg: 5x3
Session 2: 41 kg: 3x2
Session 3: 43.5 kg: 2x1
Session 4: 41 kg: 5x3
Session 5: 43.5 kg: 3x2
Session 6: 46 kg: 2x1

Which would make a massive difference to the workload of the program for me, but still wouldn't be too close to max effort.

So the question is - do I start off really low, or do I make it a bit harder and have to work for the last two weeks? I really don't want to do a 9 week cycle this time.
tokarIcon...29-05-2007 @ 21:46 
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Невыносимо Высокомерный (RIP)
Member 11, 965 posts
SQ 190, BP 140, DL 255
585.0 kgs @ 95kgs UnEq
If I was being a coach and I could just get you to do what I said, I'd tell you to start on the low side, maybe add some volume (8x3 instead of 5x3) if it was really easy, but - bench twice a week.

On the assumption that you won't be doing this I would go with the second option because I agree that 2 singles with a weight you've done 5x2 with is not a great return on 6 weeks' work - although it is possible that your strength in singles will have improved nonetheless.
littlegirlbunnyIcon...31-05-2007 @ 14:35 
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MIA
Member 7, 621 posts
SQ 80, BP 45, DL 125
250.0 kgs @ 55kgs UnEq
Originally posted by tokar...
If I was being a coach and I could just get you to do what I said, I'd tell you to start on the low side, maybe add some volume (8x3 instead of 5x3) if it was really easy, but - bench twice a week.


Could have been an option - at the moment I tend to do a bench day (bench and superwide) and a tri's day (CGBP and pinpresses) so it wouldn't have been too much to switch that round.

Originally posted by tokar...
On the assumption that you won't be doing this I would go with the second option because I agree that 2 singles with a weight you've done 5x2 with is not a great return on 6 weeks' work - although it is possible that your strength in singles will have improved nonetheless.


That's good then, because that's the one I started on! I'm hopeful it will get me back up to form for an attempt at 47.5 kg at the end. I was so bloody close to it before the comp, so fingers crossed a short cycle will be enough.
d_singhIcontokars system and assistance exercises16-05-2009 @ 12:28 
Gillette - The best a man can get
Member 466, 1389 posts
SQ 196, BP 120, DL 254
570.0 kgs @ 74kgs UnEq
hi
sounds like a good routine and im planning on starting it soon. just a question with regards to assistance exercises. how many reps should be done on them and at what intensity. i dont want to effect the progress of the routine by training to hard on assistance or too little etc
CuddlesIcon...16-05-2009 @ 12:30 
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Eat.Cycle.Sleep.Win
Member 2, 12525 posts
SQ 190, BP 150, DL 280
620.0 kgs @ 99kgs UnEq
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Well Tokar certainly wont answer you.

Fat Pete killed him.
Titan_FuryIcon...16-05-2009 @ 12:31 
my owner adds 130kg to my bench
Member 586, 219 posts
Cuddles said:
Well Tokar certainly wont answer you.

Fat Pete killed him.


Not true. He was already dead when Pete got there.
BoarIcon...16-05-2009 @ 15:56 
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I can't believe you've done this.
Member 5, 24240 posts
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Titan_Fury said:
Cuddles said:
Well Tokar certainly wont answer you.

Fat Pete killed him.


Not true. He was already dead when Pete got there.


what happened next was much , much worse.

tokar remained dead though , which was a blessing.
nicoIcon...16-05-2009 @ 19:37 
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just smoked Ed and Neil - EAT MY GOAL
Member 120, 1576 posts
Boar said:
Titan_Fury said:
Cuddles said:
Well Tokar certainly wont answer you.

Fat Pete killed him.


Not true. He was already dead when Pete got there.


what happened next was much , much worse.

tokar remained dead though , which was a blessing.


Didn't andy Bolton eat him after the whole "arrogant" incident?
richards9876Icon...04-06-2009 @ 11:15 
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Still mostly bodybuilding
Member 501, 10465 posts
SQ 220, BP 150, DL 250
620.0 kgs @ 94kgs UnEq
Just read through the article and think im going to give it a go on squats. In the article is mentions squatting twice a week - is the Tokar system still effective if i only train squats once a week.

Given that my current 1RM is 140kg would i be best doing:

Week1: 5x3 @ 130kg
Week2: 3x2 @ 135kg
Week3: 2x1 @ 140kg
Week4: 5x3 @ 135kg
Week5: 3x2 @ 140kg
Week6: 2x1 @ 145kg
Titan_FuryIcon...04-06-2009 @ 13:51 
my owner adds 130kg to my bench
Member 586, 219 posts
richards9876 said:
is the Tokar system still effective if i only train squats once a week.


Dude, the clue is in the name. TOKAR never qualified for a national title and had a constant string of training/ lifting/ looking good preventing injuries. I doubt the TOKAR system was ever effective. Ask a top flight lifter though to be certain. Someone like Andy Bolton would be able to put you straight on this.
Wink
CuddlesIcon...04-06-2009 @ 13:57 
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Eat.Cycle.Sleep.Win
Member 2, 12525 posts
SQ 190, BP 150, DL 280
620.0 kgs @ 99kgs UnEq
Administrator
He is probably the only man who could ask Tokar for you too.
RobIcon...04-06-2009 @ 15:37 
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Does f*ck all for SugdenBarbell.co.uk
Member 1, 7173 posts
SQ 182.5, BP 110, DL 205
497.5 kgs @ 107kgs UnEq
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Tokar... man or myth ... the seasons pass and the murky clouds grow, where did he go, we will never know.
triplejumperIcon...05-06-2009 @ 08:10 
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A gastric band is an option
Member 624, 109 posts
Rob said:
the seasons pass and the murky clouds grow, where did he go, we will never know.


He may of ate some dough, and played in the snow, or put on a show, found a hammer to throw, just broken his toe, got some seeds to sow, and got a boyfriend to blow?
BillwestIcon...17-06-2009 @ 19:26 
Member 541, 4031 posts
SQ 192.5, BP 120, DL 222.5
535.0 kgs @ 92.8kgs UnEq
To be fair It is a pretty simple system and if like me you have only be powerlifting training for a few months and come from bodybuilding-type training i think it can be useful. I don't suppose i'll be using it a year from now but for starting out its not bad in my opinion.

When i read some of the massive volumes that other systems use it makes some sense. One that seems to be popular is that one where you work up 5/3/1 then do
5 x 10. Pah! life's too short for high rep high volume stuff!

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