freedom of information request from the office of national statistics

slimsim said:I actually think this is a pretty bad stat. 17,000 TOTALLY healthy people diedd due to covid. That's a massive number. How many TOTALLY healthy people have you ever known who have died from flu? None, I'd expect.

dannyboy73 said:Not quiet.

worrying is the bit in the post which suggest we could have lost 50k persons due to late/ poorly treated cancer as a direct result of covid prioritisation? As Rick said, the NHS has been or has appeared to be closed for everything except the vid these past 2 years.

expert opposition needs to be heard. Until then we will have all sorts of conspiracy theories to fill these voids.

EDCLARKE said:

Probably an extra 50,000 deaths from cancer, over the past 18 months, you otherwise would not have had

Rick said:
Incidentally, Sikora made this wildly speculative claim in the first half of 2020, saying that "if this lasted another six months there could be".
So far, the number of excess cancer deaths recorded during the pandemic is... well, basically zero.
http://twitter.com/AdeleGroyer/status/1485675139685564416?t=4w... for discussion and source.

Ham said:Agreed, even if a person doesn't agree with the content/views/methods of a group pushing back it should very much be appreciated.

It is the duty of some number of folk to stand in the way of a Government (or any other all powerful type group) steam rolling a population into what they want. Even if you agree with a Gov. decisions it is a bad place to be when everyone rolls over.

Some people need to act as brakes. If they want to or not. Absolute power, corrupts absolutely.

dannyboy73 said:. As it stands, England is one of the very few countries that currently resemble a democracy.

Rick said:I'm very sorry for your loss, Ed, but this sort of thing happened all the time before COVID too. There is no doubt that we will see impacts in the future from NHS congestion, but we haven't seen them yet - in fact, Sikora tweeted this morning to say precisely that, attempting to distance himself from having this number pinned on his name. The excess cancer death toll thus far rounds to zero.

And, again, those delays are not because of lockdowns - they're because of the burden of treating COVID patients. It is something we could probably have attenuated with different policies, but not *looser* ones!

And yes, the things I mentioned ARE classed as comorbidities and ARE counted in that analysis. They may not be the most common, but it does nicely illustrate the ridiculousness of the number. People think "with comorbidities" means "at death's door". But it doesn't. Loads of people have them. I have several. Most people will by the end of their fifties. These aren't people who were going to die tomorrow anyway; on average they'd have lived another decade without COVID. If you're saying those deaths don't matter, don't count somehow, then you're a much worse person than I think you are.

(And that's before we get to the life-changing, debilitating effects on the people who had a bad case and DIDN'T die...)

Here's a thread explaining it better than I can: http://twitter.com/VictimOfMaths/status/1485570730867765251?s=...

As to that video... the whole "freedom of information request" thing is telling. It makes it sound like he's uncovering some sort of secret narrative that The Powers don't want you to know. But it's just bo***cks. ALL of that data was already in the public domain, released regularly. He's just selling his product.

Not coincidentally, he's now making upwards of £30K a month from this crap: http://twitter.com/MedCrisis/status/1485755627393716225?s=20

I don't think you're a bad person, or a stupid one. I'm not going to ban you (though I'll probably end up locking this before long). But you are letting yourself be conned by grifters.