GBPF classic lead up with a touch of weightlifting for good measure

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CC		...	13-06-2014 @ 23:54
Member 3720, 1113 posts SQ 237.5, BP 160, DL 272.5 670.0 kgs @ 120kgs UnEq	Found a video of my last competition. Looking at it, I think my weight selection for my final attempts was bang on the money. My lifts are at 0:48, 6:07, 11:13, 17:13, 21:30, 25:55, 29:11, 33:30 and 38:04.

CC		...	16-06-2014 @ 20:58
Member 3720, 1113 posts SQ 237.5, BP 160, DL 272.5 670.0 kgs @ 120kgs UnEq	Training 16/06/2014 Low bar squat 70 x 3 70 x 3 100 x 2 130 150 Belt + sleeves 170 185 200 167.5 x 5 167.5 x 5 167.5 x 5 Paused bench press Bar x 10 60 x 5 80 x 2 100 120 130 112.5 x 5 112.5 x 5 112.5 x 5 Deadlift 130 x 3 130 x 3 130 x 3 130 x 3 130 x 3 130 x 3 Squats weren't the best today but I still hit the prescribed reps. Bench felt very good today. The 130 was the best I've ever done with that sort of weight. Deadlifts felt quick and good technically. Richmond rfc were in the gym maxing out so I asked one of the guys who was overseeing it why they were all squatting very high to which he replied "because they're rugby players". He also said they wouldn't be made to squat to depth in the future either which baffles me.

JackRevans		...	16-06-2014 @ 20:59
'There was also a sausage in my mouth.' Member 2477, 16481 posts SQ 190, BP 130, DL 235 555.0 kgs @ 83kgs UnEq	nice total

VanillaGorilla		...	16-06-2014 @ 21:00
the UK's leading expert in bio mechanics Member 1973, 7379 posts	CC said:which baffles me. Why?

CC		...	16-06-2014 @ 21:09
Member 3720, 1113 posts SQ 237.5, BP 160, DL 272.5 670.0 kgs @ 120kgs UnEq	VanillaGorilla said: Why? Would it not be more productive to work on the issues which were stopping them from hitting depth rather than making them max out a 1/2 squat. I would PERSONALLY rather see someone squat 100kg to full depth rather than 1/2 squat 200kg. What is your take Dave?

CC		...	16-06-2014 @ 21:09
Member 3720, 1113 posts SQ 237.5, BP 160, DL 272.5 670.0 kgs @ 120kgs UnEq	JackRevans said:nice total Thanks Jack!

VanillaGorilla		...	16-06-2014 @ 21:17
the UK's leading expert in bio mechanics Member 1973, 7379 posts	CC said: Would it not be more productive to work on the issues which were stopping them from hitting depth rather than making them max out a 1/2 squat. I would PERSONALLY rather see someone squat 100kg to full depth rather than 1/2 squat 200kg. What is your take Dave? My take is that the work they are doing is to make them better rugby players, not better lifters. There are so many things to take into account, not least of all what is the benefit / risk / work relationship when considering why WOULD a rugby player lift like a powerlifter? Would it surprise you to knownthat there is at least one premiership rugby team that does no free bar work at all? Solely bodyweight movements, machines and hip belt work?


CC		...	16-06-2014 @ 21:30
Member 3720, 1113 posts SQ 237.5, BP 160, DL 272.5 670.0 kgs @ 120kgs UnEq	VanillaGorilla said: My take is that the work they are doing is to make them better rugby players, not better lifters. There are so many things to take into account, not least of all what is the benefit / risk / work relationship when considering why WOULD a rugby player lift like a powerlifter? Would it surprise you to knownthat there is at least one premiership rugby team that does no free bar work at all? Solely bodyweight movements, machines and hip belt work? I agree with you're first point entirely, I still think that maxing out a 1/2 squat with mediocre form is not that productive though. In regards to your last 2 points, it doesn't surprise me that some rugby teams don't do free bar work as in a starting strength interview with Mark Rippetoe, John Welbourn said that numerous NFL teams don't lift free weights in season so that isn't too much of a surprise ( worth a watch on youtube if you have the time). If squats are programmed into your program (with depth required not stated), is it not more beneficial to squat as deep as you can safely?

VanillaGorilla		...	16-06-2014 @ 21:39
the UK's leading expert in bio mechanics Member 1973, 7379 posts	Post Edited: 16.06.2014 @ 21:44 PM by VanillaGorilla "As deep as you can safely." Drawing a few assumptions based on previous knowledge, you're going to have a group of athletes who will include: Old men who have never squatted properly and don't want to. Props with impacted spines Players with internal rotation issues meaning they can't rack a bar Siezed SI joints Poor hip hinging Tight calves from driving and high bodyweight Tight hips Big egos These issues would negatively impact on being a 'lifter', but not necessarily being a rugby player. That is ultimately what they are looking to do, use lifting and aspects of lifting to improve their pitch based performances. This group probably numbers 30 players. At this level you will have 2 coaches who might get 6-10 hours with the players a week, in a group environment. They probably have a team of physios who spend their whole week unfking their already fked bodies. A head coach who will hit the roof if his first team players pick up injuries in the weights room. Needs analysis that shows they need to exert force from the 'athletic position' and partial squat pattern. With that, and much more in mind, no, they wouldn't benefit from squats done to PL standards in my opinion.

brownbear		...	16-06-2014 @ 21:59
Morrisons - rump - 7£ Member 2206, 11578 posts SQ 228, BP 150, DL 260 638.0 kgs @ 98kgs UnEq	VanillaGorilla said:"As deep as you can safely." Drawing a few assumptions based on previous knowledge, you're going to have a group of athletes who will include: Old men who have never squatted properly and don't want to. Props with impacted spines Players with internal rotation issues meaning they can't rack a bar Siezed SI joints Poor hip hinging Tight calves from driving and high bodyweight Tight hips Big egos These issues would negatively impact on being a 'lifter', but not necessarily being a rugby player. That is ultimately what they are looking to do, use lifting and aspects of lifting to improve their pitch based performances. This group probably numbers 30 players. At this level you will have 2 coaches who might get 6-10 hours with the players a week, in a group environment. They probably have a team of physios who spend their whole week unfking their already fked bodies. A head coach who will hit the roof if his first team players pick up injuries in the weights room. Needs analysis that shows they need to exert force from the 'athletic position' and partial squat pattern. With that, and much more in mind, no, they wouldn't benefit from squats done to PL standards in my opinion. That's a good point Dave do you think IF rugby players could safely perform full squats, they would be beneficial compared to partial squats either off season or both in and off season?

VanillaGorilla		...	16-06-2014 @ 22:06
the UK's leading expert in bio mechanics Member 1973, 7379 posts	brownbear said: That's a good point Dave do you think IF rugby players could safely perform full squats, they would be beneficial compared to partial squats either off season or both in and off season? Potentially in various preperatory phases yea. I'm spoiled as I'm mostly dealing with 20 year olds with no issues, and they do benefit from full squats for the most part.

CC		...	17-06-2014 @ 21:03
Member 3720, 1113 posts SQ 237.5, BP 160, DL 272.5 670.0 kgs @ 120kgs UnEq	Training 17/06/2014 High bar squats 60 x 3 100 x 3 100 x 3 100 x 3 100 x 3 100 x 3 100 x 3 100 x 3 100 x 3 Paused bench press Bar x 10 77.5 x 3 77.5 x 3 77.5 x 3 77.5 x 3 77.5 x 3 77.5 x 3 77.5 x 3 77.5 x 3 SLDL 70 x 3 110 150 180 160 x 5 160 x 5 160 x 5 Squats were fine. Bench press was fine but a bit of pain in my elbows again. SLDL's felt decent today. Had to do a lot of driving these last 2 days because of work which isn't great on my lower back. Tomorrow will be the last day of having to do so, then after that back to normal.

CC		...	18-06-2014 @ 20:18
Member 3720, 1113 posts SQ 237.5, BP 160, DL 272.5 670.0 kgs @ 120kgs UnEq	Training 18/06/2014 High bar squat 70 x 3 110 140 Belt + sleeves 160 177.5 192.5 175 x 3 Paused bench press Bar x 10 60 x 3 80 x 2 100 120 132.5 117.5 x 3 My form on squats was pretty poor today. Heels nearly came off the floor on 192.5. I also had quite bad pain in my soleus when squatting today. I try and stretch it out most days but it looks like I need to do even more work on it. I had some pain in my elbows when benching today but it was manageable. Both top sets felt really good today. I also came home to find my order of the book 'The white prisoner - The secret story of Galabin Boevski' had arrived which I'm very much looking forward to reading.

CC		...	19-06-2014 @ 20:56
Member 3720, 1113 posts SQ 237.5, BP 160, DL 272.5 670.0 kgs @ 120kgs UnEq	Training 19/06/2014 High bar squat 60 x 3 100 x 3 100 x 3 100 x 3 100 x 3 100 x 3 100 x 3 100 x 3 100 x 3 Paused bench press Bar x 10 77.5 x 3 77.5 x 3 77.5 x 3 77.5 x 3 78.5 x 3 77.5 x 3 77.5 x 3 77.5 x 3 SLDL 70 x 3 115 155 185 165 x 5 165 x 5 165 x 5 Less pain today in my calves when squatting and elbows when benching but then again it is less weight. SLDL's were hard today. I think this is due to my lower back feeling like s**t after driving for about 3 hours each day. Tomorrow is definitely my last day of having to travel to Henley each day though.

CC		...	20-06-2014 @ 19:51
Member 3720, 1113 posts SQ 237.5, BP 160, DL 272.5 670.0 kgs @ 120kgs UnEq	Training 20/06/2014 Low bar squat 70 x 3 100 x 2 130 150 Belt + sleeves 170 190 205 167.5 x 5 167.5 x 5 167.5 x 5 167.5 x 5 Paused bench press Bar x 10 60 x 3 80 x 2 100 120 127.5 x 2 (pb) 112.5 x 5 112.5 x 5 112.5 x 5 112.5 x 5 Deadlift 130 x 3 130 x 3 130 x 3 130 x 3 130 x 3 130 x 3 On the drive to the gym I manufactured myself a lower back support in the form of a pair of rolled up trackie bottoms so when I arrived, I had no back pain at all which is excellent. I do however have to go back in on Monday which is very frustrating seeing as I was only meant to be there Monday and Tuesday this week! On the plus side I do get paid more. So squats were good today, nothing spectacular but all reps were solid. The double on bench was an all time pb and I did it paused. Sets on 112.5 were ok. Deadlifts were quick.

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