EU vote
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John29/06/16 @ 12:42
macroth said:
No it hasn't, but you keep saying it has. The fact that a great number of leave voters have xenophobic tendencies does not mean that you, John, are racist. You really need to start understanding the nuance here otherwise, at some point it's going to sound like you're protesting too much.
No it hasn't, but you keep saying it has. The fact that a great number of leave voters have xenophobic tendencies does not mean that you, John, are racist. You really need to start understanding the nuance here otherwise, at some point it's going to sound like you're protesting too much.
the general feel of the entire thread is one of intolerance of other people's views and name calling if this isn't the case I apologise.I will go back and read all comments again just to be sure.
John said:
the general feel of the entire thread is one of intolerance of other people's views and name calling
the general feel of the entire thread is one of intolerance of other people's views and name calling
This is exactly what any discussion about the referendum seems to be.
LEAVE = RACIST!!
REMAIN = DEMOCRACY HATING SHEEP!!
Of course, the problem from a language perspective is that 'racist' is the magic bullet of insults.
You get called a racist; it is up to you to "prove" you are not. Attempts to do so often go down the "Some of my best friends are..." line.
You call something/someone racist; well, there will always be someone else who will take note of that and/or jump on the bandwagon to besmirch someone's name.
Steve29/06/16 @ 13:55
matthewvc said:
The England they mourn the loss of is the England of Richard Littlejohn, not of morris dancing and dreaming spires.
A place where you can say what you want, unshackled by 'PC gone mad'.
Not a Mosque in sight, brown face on the bus or gays holding hands.
Very like the early 70's prior the EU entry with casual racism on TV
and 'no black, irish, pakis' signs outside B+B and rental properties up the land.
A nasty little insular England.
The England they mourn the loss of is the England of Richard Littlejohn, not of morris dancing and dreaming spires.
A place where you can say what you want, unshackled by 'PC gone mad'.
Not a Mosque in sight, brown face on the bus or gays holding hands.
Very like the early 70's prior the EU entry with casual racism on TV
and 'no black, irish, pakis' signs outside B+B and rental properties up the land.
A nasty little insular England.
Sorry, but that's total nonsense.
Robbo9129/06/16 @ 14:09
The media loves sensationalism. The racists get put in front of the camera and they give all leave voters a bad name.
The same way the minority of immigrants that live off the state make the headlines and tarnish the reputation of all immigrants. This no doubt played a part in some leave voters thinking (i.e.those multi-tasking foreigners who steal both our jobs and benefits at the same time)
My main gripe with all this is the lack of knowledge leave voters seemed to have (well certainly the ones regretting their decision now). A lot of the people I've spoken to personally who voted leave did so for one single reason instead of, in my opinion, staying for many. Their justification for their choice of vote normally started with 'well apparently the EU won't let us . . . Insert small complaint here. . .'
In this era when we all have a device connected to all the information we could ever need in our pockets, I'm disappointed at how well the propaganda and politicians sound bites worked.
The same way the minority of immigrants that live off the state make the headlines and tarnish the reputation of all immigrants. This no doubt played a part in some leave voters thinking (i.e.those multi-tasking foreigners who steal both our jobs and benefits at the same time)
My main gripe with all this is the lack of knowledge leave voters seemed to have (well certainly the ones regretting their decision now). A lot of the people I've spoken to personally who voted leave did so for one single reason instead of, in my opinion, staying for many. Their justification for their choice of vote normally started with 'well apparently the EU won't let us . . . Insert small complaint here. . .'
In this era when we all have a device connected to all the information we could ever need in our pockets, I'm disappointed at how well the propaganda and politicians sound bites worked.
scruffmcbuff29/06/16 @ 14:17
danbaseley said:
This is exactly what any discussion about the referendum seems to be.
LEAVE = RACIST!!
REMAIN = DEMOCRACY HATING SHEEP!!
Of course, the problem from a language perspective is that 'racist' is the magic bullet of insults.
You get called a racist; it is up to you to "prove" you are not. Attempts to do so often go down the "Some of my best friends are..." line.
You call something/someone racist; well, there will always be someone else who will take note of that and/or jump on the bandwagon to besmirch someone's name.
This is exactly what any discussion about the referendum seems to be.
LEAVE = RACIST!!
REMAIN = DEMOCRACY HATING SHEEP!!
Of course, the problem from a language perspective is that 'racist' is the magic bullet of insults.
You get called a racist; it is up to you to "prove" you are not. Attempts to do so often go down the "Some of my best friends are..." line.
You call something/someone racist; well, there will always be someone else who will take note of that and/or jump on the bandwagon to besmirch someone's name.
Im not racist,I cant be, my father is a dirty irish bas***d.
John29/06/16 @ 14:19
Post Edited: 29.06.2016 @ 14:20 PM by John
Steve said:
Sorry, but that's total nonsense.
Sorry, but that's total nonsense.
I'm worried this is actually what you think leavers are about even if this is tongue in cheek.
John29/06/16 @ 14:22
matthewvc said:
The England they mourn the loss of is the England of Richard Littlejohn, not of morris dancing and dreaming spires.
A place where you can say what you want, unshackled by 'PC gone mad'.
Not a Mosque in sight, brown face on the bus or gays holding hands.
Very like the early 70's prior the EU entry with casual racism on TV
and 'no black, irish, pakis' signs outside B+B and rental properties up the land.
A nasty little insular England.
The England they mourn the loss of is the England of Richard Littlejohn, not of morris dancing and dreaming spires.
A place where you can say what you want, unshackled by 'PC gone mad'.
Not a Mosque in sight, brown face on the bus or gays holding hands.
Very like the early 70's prior the EU entry with casual racism on TV
and 'no black, irish, pakis' signs outside B+B and rental properties up the land.
A nasty little insular England.
Oops was referring to this apologise (Steve)
baldt29/06/16 @ 14:35
Robbo91 said:
My main gripe with all this is the lack of knowledge leave voters seemed to have (well certainly the ones regretting their decision now). A lot of the people I've spoken to personally who voted leave did so for one single reason instead of, in my opinion, staying for many. Their justification for their choice of vote normally started with 'well apparently the EU won't let us . . . Insert small complaint here. . .'
In this era when we all have a device connected to all the information we could ever need in our pockets, I'm disappointed at how well the propaganda and politicians sound bites worked.
My main gripe with all this is the lack of knowledge leave voters seemed to have (well certainly the ones regretting their decision now). A lot of the people I've spoken to personally who voted leave did so for one single reason instead of, in my opinion, staying for many. Their justification for their choice of vote normally started with 'well apparently the EU won't let us . . . Insert small complaint here. . .'
In this era when we all have a device connected to all the information we could ever need in our pockets, I'm disappointed at how well the propaganda and politicians sound bites worked.
I voted leave, its the right thing to do and at no point do I need to even mention migration to justify my decision. Most of the remain arguments I have seen are flawed, certainly the economic ones
Steve29/06/16 @ 14:40
Robbo91 said:The media loves sensationalism. The racists get put in front of the camera and they give all leave voters a bad name.
The same way the minority of immigrants that live off the state make the headlines and tarnish the reputation of all immigrants. This no doubt played a part in some leave voters thinking (i.e.those multi-tasking foreigners who steal both our jobs and benefits at the same time)
My main gripe with all this is the lack of knowledge leave voters seemed to have (well certainly the ones regretting their decision now). A lot of the people I've spoken to personally who voted leave did so for one single reason instead of, in my opinion, staying for many. Their justification for their choice of vote normally started with 'well apparently the EU won't let us . . . Insert small complaint here. . .'
In this era when we all have a device connected to all the information we could ever need in our pockets, I'm disappointed at how well the propaganda and politicians sound bites worked.
The same way the minority of immigrants that live off the state make the headlines and tarnish the reputation of all immigrants. This no doubt played a part in some leave voters thinking (i.e.those multi-tasking foreigners who steal both our jobs and benefits at the same time)
My main gripe with all this is the lack of knowledge leave voters seemed to have (well certainly the ones regretting their decision now). A lot of the people I've spoken to personally who voted leave did so for one single reason instead of, in my opinion, staying for many. Their justification for their choice of vote normally started with 'well apparently the EU won't let us . . . Insert small complaint here. . .'
In this era when we all have a device connected to all the information we could ever need in our pockets, I'm disappointed at how well the propaganda and politicians sound bites worked.
Whilst I'm sure there were many people who voted leave for just one reason, I'm sure there were equally many people who voted to stay who lacked any real knowledge. If you listen to some of the young remain voter constantly complaining in the media at the moment you would think it was totally impossible for anything to function outside the EU.
baldt29/06/16 @ 14:45
Post Edited: 29.06.2016 @ 15:05 PM by matthewvc
John said:
Oops was referring to this apologise (Steve)
Oops was referring to this apologise (Steve)
I was being somewhat polemic, but there's a kernel of truth in it.
Do you read the output of The Sun? Most read newspaper in UK?
Or realise that Britain First has something like 1.5million likes on FB?
I have about 50 friends on facebook, and I've had to
block updates from 3 because of them sharing their poisonous s**te
and i'm your dyed-in-the-wool guardian reading leftie, so i'm hardly going to mate around BNP supporters.
Racism and bigotry is like any spectrum disorder. At one extreme there's the Combat 18 lot waving the flag and screaming about muslamic ray guns, at the other extreme are people like some of my older relatives, nice enough people; happy to talk to their foreign neighbour yet mutter about 'these Romanians are always on the take'.
The country is full of festering jingoism like this. Pretend it doesn't exist at your peril.
The leave platform in particular Nigel's input, was built on english nationalism, anti-immigration
for that reason and the votes came flooding in.
Robbo9129/06/16 @ 16:03
Steve said:
Whilst I'm sure there were many people who voted leave for just one reason, I'm sure there were equally many people who voted to stay who lacked any real knowledge. If you listen to some of the young remain voter constantly complaining in the media at the moment you would think it was totally impossible for anything to function outside the EU.
Whilst I'm sure there were many people who voted leave for just one reason, I'm sure there were equally many people who voted to stay who lacked any real knowledge. If you listen to some of the young remain voter constantly complaining in the media at the moment you would think it was totally impossible for anything to function outside the EU.
I agree with you. The only real difference being people were voting for change or for things to stay unchanged. Voting for change without knowing any consequences just seems more risky to me, hence the people bricking themselves the day after when the pound fell.
Robbo9129/06/16 @ 16:08
baldt said:
I voted leave, its the right thing to do and at no point do I need to even mention migration to justify my decision. Most of the remain arguments I have seen are flawed, certainly the economic ones
I voted leave, its the right thing to do and at no point do I need to even mention migration to justify my decision. Most of the remain arguments I have seen are flawed, certainly the economic ones
Obviously 'the right thing to do' is a personal opinion, but I completely respect your opinion on it because you're actually aware of arguments for and against.
You also mentioned about young voters not voting and that's another thing I'm very disappointed in.
scruffmcbuff29/06/16 @ 16:12
Robbo91 said:
I agree with you. The only real difference being people were voting for change or for things to stay unchanged. Voting for change without knowing any consequences just seems more risky to me, hence the people bricking themselves the day after when the pound fell.
I agree with you. The only real difference being people were voting for change or for things to stay unchanged. Voting for change without knowing any consequences just seems more risky to me, hence the people bricking themselves the day after when the pound fell.
Another sign that these people knew nothing the effect the brexit would have on the pound the ftse 100 and ftse200 have been written about freeking loads on the lead up to all this.
Why would something you was told would happen startle someone?
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