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» coronavirus (Go to post)27-06-2021 @ 16:02 
ChrisMcCarthy said:I think we all agree the Lockdown has had many deleterious effects which as a society we'll all be feeling for many years to come...which is surely one of the better reasons I can think of for following the guidelines to try and get it over with as quickly as possible...


not if the deleterious effects far outweigh the benefits. which, amongst other topics, is what the large part of the debate in this thread has been over.

the question is, what is worse? the cure or the disease.
» coronavirus (Go to post)27-06-2021 @ 09:27 
Wayne_Cowdrey said:Oh dear, this is a very emotive subject.


indeed.

which is why I suggested no good would come of bringing personal s**t in here.

my personal experience has lead me to the conclusion that these lockdown restrictions have and are causing far more harm than the virus ever could. its not even close. my friends and family have been devastated by lockdown policy. therefore, I will argue against them with everything I have. for the sake of myself, my family and everyone I know who has been affected by them.

I would ask anyone who supports these restrictions to consider the mental health patients whos care has been removed, those who have commited or attempted to commit suicide, those terminally ill cancer patients who had their treatment cancelled and life expectancy shortened, those who have had cancers left undiagnosed, those who died in hospital alone, those who were left fighting for their lives in intensive care alone, those who have lost their jobs, those who have lost their business, those who have lost their homes.

I could tell a true story about every single one of those instances from a friend or a family member. none of them linked to covid the disease. all of them linked to the lockdown.

thats my experience. others will have a totally different one, leading them to completely different conclusions. I just think it better to put that all aside and have an objective a discussion as is possible.
» coronavirus (Go to post)26-06-2021 @ 13:58 
billynomates said:
Who'd ever dream of it? Wink
Why would it be staged?


Grin

a distraction from more serious offences.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jun/17/hancock-care-...

The evidence is clear – there was no excuse for Hancock’s care homes strategy
William Hanage


The health secretary’s failure to act on scientific worst-case scenarios informed policy, with catastrophic results

The UK has suffered some of the worst consequences of the pandemic among developed nations, in terms of both deaths and economic disruption. But instead of learning from its mistakes, all the evidence suggests that the British government is trying to rewrite history while the pandemic is still going on.

When the health secretary, Matt Hancock, appeared in front of MPs last week to answer questions about the government’s early handling of the virus, part of the questioning centred on the devastation that the virus had been allowed to wreak in care homes among residents and staff.

While it is genuinely hard to pick the worst failure of the UK’s pandemic response, this has to be a contender. The numbers remain to be fully catalogued and may never be fully known, because testing was in such short supply early on in the pandemic, but the Office for National Statistics estimates 42,000 care home residents in England and Wales have died of Covid. This outcome was entirely predictable in the absence of meaningful infection control.


the thing I have been most disappointed in the british public for in this whole affair is their indifference to the above story.

I think hancock is a dead man walking politically and it is even possible that there are more stories to come.

given that, it would then be handy to a) flood the news cycle with this nonsense and/or b) provide political cover for boris to fire him or for him to step down. any other more serious crimes would be easier to brush under the carpet suiting both hancock and the tories.

when you add that to the somewhat unlikely story of that t**t managing to pull more than one bird and the awkward as f**k video my spidey senses start tingling.
» The Epic of Gilgamesh (Go to post)26-06-2021 @ 13:37 
JCarter123 said:
You done good mate. And if you’re in the final, even better!


cheers dude.

Training today:

Log press:

64kg x 3
74kg x 3
80kg x 1
90kg x 1
100kg x 1

Axle clean + press:

50kg x 1
60kg x 1
70kg x 1
80kg x 1
90kg x 1
100kg x 1

that session when you think you are recovered from the comp but you really are not.
» coronavirus (Go to post)26-06-2021 @ 10:26 
call me a conspiracist but this s**t looks staged to me.

» coronavirus (Go to post)25-06-2021 @ 22:23 
Rick said:
And I don't watch the videos


ok.



heres another for those that do, summarising some studies from mexico, peru and india showing promising results for the use of ivermectin as both therapeutic and prophylactic against covid.
» coronavirus (Go to post)25-06-2021 @ 21:39 
Post Edited: 25.06.2021 @ 21:41 PM by WILLSAN
ChrisMcCarthy said:
demand answers


I wouldnt be so bold as to demand anything from you.

call it an encouragement to improve your ratio.

I hope you find some time to contribute positively at some point.
» coronavirus (Go to post)25-06-2021 @ 20:53 
ChrisMcCarthy said:
Sorry, I do forget that I'm not always clear online!
I'll get back to you with a longer response on this - if I don't within a couple of days please don't let me forget. Happy


https://i.giphy.com/media/WZOffTa9X1FZe/giphy.webp
» coronavirus (Go to post)25-06-2021 @ 20:50 
Rick said:
True, said the not particularly black kettle.


who openly admits to not looking at any of the links posted? who posted a debunk of a video they never watched?

only one of us.

Rick said:
What, with the vaccine they don't manufacture and aren't making a profit on and that was developed by a totally different group? Hah.


whos name is [was] loudly and proudly proclaimed in the name of the vaccine itself?

I have a good understanding of the culture inside a certain high profile counterpart of oxford university and I can tell you name and reputation is very important to these particular universities. I have questions over their impartiality as I am sure others would.

Rick said:
That's why I'm posting expert opinion from people working in the field, and that reflects what I think you actually agree is the broad consensus of the expert view.


I dont think that article is a particularly glittering example of an expert opinion from someone working in the field. kinda seems like a random blogger.

and the videos that ed and I referenced featured bret weinstein, an evolutionary biologist, dr pierre kory, an intensive care doc specializing in treating covid and dr robert malone, who invented mrna vaccines.

why are their views unworthy of your attention?

why not give the videos some of your time?

surely a man of science would enjoy the spectacle of the cut and thrust of the scientific method in action.

Rick said:
No. Because the question is whether the treatment improves outcomes. We don't know whether Ivermectin does, and it's very plausible from what little quality evidence we actually have that it worsens them. Whereas we have tons of high quality evidence on the effectiveness of the vaccines, and it is implausible that there will be any of the long term effects you keep scare-mongering about because of the very well-understood way that they work. Again, I've linked to quality explanations of this already.


my assertion is that the evidence ivermectin is effective is being suppressed to enable the expedited approval of this new class of vaccine. there are many papers coming out all the time adding to the body of evidence but they are just being ignored or disparaged because of this.

along with drs on the frontline using this protocol successfully with their patients. scientific modelling and anaylsis has been particularly s**t throughout this crisis so I am minded to weight their opinions with at least as much credibility as the scientific community myself.

did you notice that the india headlines melted into background?

what therapeutic, against WHO advice, do you think they decided to add to their treatment protocol?

https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/640/cpsprodpb/11A56/production/_119087227_optimised-india_cases_deaths_25jun-nc.png

https://www.medpagetoday.com/special-reports/exclusives/92644

Indian States Turn to Ivermectin in COVID Crisis
— Two states give anti-parasitic preventatively to large swaths of population despite warnings
by Kristina Fiore, Director of Enterprise & Investigative Reporting, MedPage Today May 18, 2021
» coronavirus (Go to post)25-06-2021 @ 17:41 
ChrisMcCarthy said:Will,

You know Malone (for one) likely has a conflict of interest here too, right?


I asked for this conflict of interest to be defined earlier in the thread but no one offered one. maybe you could enlighten me?

ChrisMcCarthy said:Again, this "discussion" is largely no one believing anyone elses references.


I would suggest that your repetitive critique of the thread itself rather than the topic at hand is contributing to this being a 'discussion' rather than a discussion.

you promised ed some substantive analysis. lets hear it.
» coronavirus (Go to post)25-06-2021 @ 16:42 
Rick said:Ivermectin is not being suppressed. It just isn't.


making absolute statements without considering both sides of a debate is foolish.

Rick said:I believe there's a massive, high-quality trial under way at Oxford right now that will hopefully tell us if it works. It would be good if it did.


sounds like a possible conflict of interest.

Rick said:At the moment, we simply do not know if it works or not, because there are almost no decent quality studies on it, and the ones there are pretty much say: can't tell. It certainly ain't a miracle drug. It's very much not clear that it's better than the other cheap treatment protocols available.


there are a lot of studies on it. I am not in a position to assess their quality but maybe you are. have you looked at them yourself? or are you relying on the judgement of others?

Rick said:It's not actually clear that it had any benefit at all, and it might even be harmful.


can you see a double standard here?

cheap off patent therapeutic in use for 40 years 'might' be harmful so shouldnt be used and any discussion of it should be censored.

vs

comparatively expensive never before used in human populations mrna/adenovirus vaccines should be given emergency use licenses and actively promoted across the population of the entire globe despite no long term testing.

doesnt sound like an even playing field to me. particularly as the whole basis of the emergency use is contingent on there being no effective therapeutics being available.

Rick said:Which is why its own manufacturers do not recommend it for this purpose.


sounds compelling on first reading. but again, there is a possible conflict of interests here. being as ivermectin is off patent merck stands to make very little from its use. however, they do stand to make bank from the production of vaccines.

http://www.pmlive.com/pharma_news/merck_and_co_to_help_produce...

Merck & Co to help produce J&J’s COVID-19 vaccine in the US
Company has signed agreements to bolster vaccine manufacturing capacity


Merck & Co – known as MSD outside the US and Canada – has signed multiple agreements to expand manufacturing capacity supply of COVID-19 vaccines, including Johnson & Johnson’s (J&J) jab.


Rick said:Here's a detailed article with citations and numbers explaining exactly what we do and don't know. http://gidmk.medium.com/does-ivermectin-work-for-covid-19-1166...


I think your description is a little off the mark. the citations and numbers in the article only relate to the two papers which the author offers analysis on. this gives the impression that this is the sum total of evidence supporting ivermectin which is simply not true. this makes me think that there is a degree of misdirection or lazy research at work here.

id encourage you to take a look at the video ed suggested or this one to hear the counter arguments.

https://odysee.com/@BretWeinstein:f/COVID-Ivermectin-and-the-Crime-of-the-Century-DarkHorse-Podcast-with-Pierre-Kory-Bret-Weinstein:f

these are not conspiracy theorists. they are bright men making compelling arguments and they sound genuine in their beliefs to me. whether they are right or wrong I think it worth anyones time to hear what they have to say.

at the end of the day you dont have to believe in the new world order to consider that big business might use its power and influence to put profits ahead of the welfare of humanity.
» Kaos Strongest Teen 2021 (Go to post)24-06-2021 @ 19:31 




» coronavirus (Go to post)24-06-2021 @ 19:00 
ChrisMcCarthy said:
Will,
I know who was involved here.


good.

others will too now.

hopefully they will watch the content and make their own judgement.
» coronavirus (Go to post)24-06-2021 @ 18:48 
ChrisMcCarthy said:
Because YouTube have a Policy of not allowing any old (damaging) s**t people want to shout about, I guess.
Really it was all there in my post above, had you read it and not just added it to my Derailing Count.


if you had watched the video or the previous video you would have seen that is was a doctor, representing a collective of doctors working for a non profit who are trying to find treatments for covid. they have successfully treated many patients with their protocol which includes ivermectin. they talk about the studies that back up their claims and the possible motivation to suppress therapeutic treatments.

the second video features the inventor of MRNA vaccines, Dr. Robert Malone, who whilst advocating for the safety of MRNA vaccines in general is raising serious questions about the MRNA vaccines we are using to treat covid.

I find them credible and, to be quite honest, I think the suppresion of their voices is damaging whether their views are founded or not.

dangerous lies are more likely to come from censorship than from free speech.
» coronavirus (Go to post)24-06-2021 @ 18:22 
ChrisMcCarthy said:
Ah, well in that case I believe my point was that seemingly YouTube were indeed correct to remove those videos for term of service strikes.


why?

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