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160kg push press behind the neck

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Tom_MartinIcon...28-04-2012 @ 12:35 
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No one believed him anyway.
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HUGE_GUY said:Yea, by sprinters standards you are pretty big! Even my size, i have a little bit of quad and back muscle so everyone asks if im a rugby player and say im too big to jump. Gets annoying.

I forget, what i think is big some of the behemoths here will laugh at.


You're quads are still bigger than mine...! Unhappy so are Shaun Cleggs and he weighs 69kg...

What do the elitettrack forumers think about your numbers? I got slated once for saying someones target weights for an elite sprinter were easily achievable and there was no good reason why anyone at any level shouldn't put the little effort required to achieve that base level of strength. Maybe I was wrong though, maybe a 110 power clean and 180 squat is only required if you're running 10.2...
ben66Icon...28-04-2012 @ 12:36 
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Why get fat to look big?
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Very strong Tom.
HUGE_GUYIcon...28-04-2012 @ 14:20 
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I might destroy the planet
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Tom, I've had enough of them on that forum. They're all 'experts' and only listen to what they want to hear. I am far too strong apparently, and don't have a clue what im doing in the gym. But it's funny how i dont even do jump training and im as good as them guys. It's obvious we are more talented than most athletes when it comes to strength though. I lift twice a week and short sessions. Some guys train much more to reach their 110 p.clean, but can use all of their strength efficiently whereas I/we? waste loads of energy with s**t form, and we're not black.

I was talking to 2 uka coaches just the other day about this, 1 guy says the sky is the limit, keep getting stronger, power to weight is the foundation everyone wants. The other says i can perform just as well from a 140 clean. You never know though, if you actually trained for sprinting again under a good coach, you could be in for a good pb. Speed just takes much longer to develop than strength. Long answer to a short question...
Tom_MartinIcon...28-04-2012 @ 14:55 
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No one believed him anyway.
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My favourite kind of answer lol, especially while i'm at work.

I think poor training rather than average genetics is the reason why these guys struggle to hit average targets like 110 power clean. Do some full squats (like you do), build some proper glute strength at proper joint angles (again, full squats, not glute bridges etc) and then see what happens to your 2nd pull/power clean. Improve your 2nd pull and see what happens to your speed on the track.... Just my thoughts anyway.

Regarding your technique, yeah you catch the bar like s**t, so do I, but to be able to generate so much force from a hang is far more relevant to athletic performance than....anything else really.

I was always under the impression that weights they considered only necessary for the elite, were attainable for anyone with maybe an hour of proper squatting every week, might do them a lot of good, and won't do them any harm at all. Why not set aside the time to achieve a 2x bodyweight squat and tick off another box on your list of useful tools... It's not going to destroy anyones training...
HUGE_GUYIcon...28-04-2012 @ 15:24 
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Most athletes i have spoken to build up reasonable strength in the off season with full squats, but nearer the season are scared to keep lifting incase their reactive strength goes down which is bo***cks. If they squat its quater which does nothing and they won't lift more than 80% on cleans and regularly do 60-70% and call it 'speed' work. Cleans are too slow for speed work, and that's too light to maintain power.

Here's a good way to find out if what we do works for track - im getting a jumps/sprints coach after surgery and a good one. If next year im top few in the world, we'll know the power to weight is very important and it does transfer even with limited specific training.

Interesting point someone made on that forum a while ago. If sprinters are on gear while doing max speed work (which they do), they create muscle fibres and tendon stiffness perfect for speed which is otherwise impossible to obtain.
rottieIcon...28-04-2012 @ 21:22 
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truly awsome
CuddlesIcon...29-04-2012 @ 09:48 
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Eat.Cycle.Sleep.Win
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I guess that's pretty decent.
Wayne_CowdreyIcon...29-04-2012 @ 11:31 
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Still got a little bit of strength
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You're an amazing lifter Happy
Luke27Icon...29-04-2012 @ 22:01 
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lets get learning !!!
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HUGE_GUY said:Most athletes i have spoken to build up reasonable strength in the off season with full squats, but nearer the season are scared to keep lifting incase their reactive strength goes down which is bo***cks. If they squat its quater which does nothing and they won't lift more than 80% on cleans and regularly do 60-70% and call it 'speed' work. Cleans are too slow for speed work, and that's too light to maintain power.

Here's a good way to find out if what we do works for track - im getting a jumps/sprints coach after surgery and a good one. If next year im top few in the world, we'll know the power to weight is very important and it does transfer even with limited specific training.

Interesting point someone made on that forum a while ago. If sprinters are on gear while doing max speed work (which they do), they create muscle fibres and tendon stiffness perfect for speed which is otherwise impossible to obtain.


What your opinion of half squats ? I know that charlie francis favored them as ben johnson was squating up in the 600lbs and though it posed less structural risk. He also said the risk vs rewards was important and that other forms of training were much more effective as the base strength should have already been made and only needed to be maintained while other more effective training was utilized i.e shock training
HUGE_GUYIcon...29-04-2012 @ 22:12 
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Ben did box squats (still half i know). There's a vid of him doing them just a couple of years ago. Most top sprinters now do general weight training and like i said they are on gear while doing speed work, so that's where they get their specific speed power from, not converting weights to the track like i was trying to do.

In general, i would only ever do full squats. Half squats is more weight and puts more stress on patella tendon, and generally to balance you need to lean forwards, taking the weight off the glutes a little. Oh and more weight means more cns fatigue in squats? Weightlifters can oly squat everyday, i couldnt see any powerlifter doing the same, but maybe im wrong.
Luke27Icon...29-04-2012 @ 22:29 
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lets get learning !!!
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I think converting weight to track is obviously very hard to do, however in my opinion we organize our training in the wrong manner as we dont plan the training in the right order that being strength and General work should be done before athletes are at a competitive level thus coaches still have much more effective training means to improve performance. Such as reactive jumps, death jumps and other form of shock training which should only be utilized once all other adaptation has been taken. Yet it takes such good strength to be able to do these properly.

From the charlie francis material ive bought i have never seen box squats but its interesting to know thank you , i can see the benefits of box squat over full squats for certain athletes.

Weightlifters I think have been conditioned over many years to able to handle this work load, not many powerlifters start when they are 12-15 so therefore do not in my opinion have the background to handle this, if they took 3 years to set the foundations and build it up over time so that the body got used to it slowly then i believe it would be possible.

Very interesting discussion though.

what is your opinion of the likes of Harry AA who have huge strength and explosive power ?
HUGE_GUYIcon...29-04-2012 @ 22:47 
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Post Edited: 29.04.2012 @ 22:49 PM by HUGE_GUY
Do you do athletics Luke?

Harry aa. I don't believe he has massive power really and think hes been hyped up too much.

We've seen his power clean vid, and almost double bw is pretty decent but not unheard of at all, plus he's short. I've heard of his other power tests like standing broad jump and overhead shot, and they just seem decent, nothing special. As an overall athlete he's awesome though. Not many guys can be so fast, lift decent etc.

Shock training, i did that for a month before my pbs. Squats and depth jumps Deffinately works.
Luke27Icon...30-04-2012 @ 00:33 
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Nah , just have alot of interest in physical preparation for track and field i love the disciplines and the devotion the athletes give, team sports often dont have that same dedication.

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